listen to what he and boehner have said since the election, boehner is clearly open to revenue, doesn't want rates to go up. the president is going to reassert that wealthy have to pay some. but you can actually bridge that divide if you get into pay through something other than higher rates. for example, closing off deductions. those are the kind of -- >> the thing that mitt romney was talking about but was not specific in one of the debates. >> if you think about it the president has talked about tax reform, his acceptance speech. i don't expect him to get into details of how he'll do that. the key is the tone as andrew was saying, people confidence is very important here, es special lir to the markets, the economy, the president to come out and say we won here's the mandate you take this, take our conditions or you'll bear it on your head if a recession happens, that i think is not what the markets want to see. >> and andrew ross sorkin, as we wait for the president to walk in, what -- we see now is that the gang of eight have been meeting. you've had bob corker and others participat